FabGuys.com forum: Moving in the new year

By *essa_M OP TV/TS
4 days ago

Luton

We are probably moving to the NW of England in the New Year. According to our plans it should be around the 2nd week in February. Although a chunk of that is down to lawyers etc.

Anyway, seeking a bit of advice. The property we are moving to has a very old gas boiler. Taking into account it's age, it is condemned and needs replacing.

We spoke to our gas engineer who has done all the work on our existing place and he has made some suggestions. Replacing the boiler etc and a wee bit of new pipe work.

It has been suggested that we consider a heat pump. not the drill underground kind, an air source one. Apparently there is substantial grants for installing one. Also the suggested lifetime is 20 years as opposed to 10 for a gas boiler.

Having never used, or had any experience of heat pumps. Could I ask for what advice fellow fabbers would suggest.

Speaking to my mate tonight. His advice is we keep our house warmer than his by a couple of degrees. He's not sure it would be a good idea. Then again he knows as much about heat pumps as I do

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By *hiteroseMan
4 days ago

Neverwhere

As I understand it, air source heat pumps circulate water at a lower temperature than conventional gas boilers. For that reason it is often recommended that larger radiators are installed to provide the necessary heat output. If that is required then you may incur additional costs.

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By *ustPeekinMan
4 days ago

Alresford

I understand that they aren’t so great for large properties unless they bare really well insulated. As said above, the water temperature is lower.

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By *b72Man
4 days ago

Moray

"As I understand it, air source heat pumps circulate water at a lower temperature than conventional gas boilers. For that reason it is often recommended that larger radiators are installed to provide the necessary heat output. If that is required then you may incur additional costs."

You’re right, heat pumps don’t produce the same temperatures as a boiler can. You’d probably have to install a hot water cylinder as well which are much bigger than an old style one.

Have you considered a hybrid heating system which uses both a heat pump and a gas boiler. These normally consist of a smaller heat pump for the heating and a smaller boiler for hot water and you might get away with using existing radiators and no need for a hot water cylinder

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By *einmeMan
4 days ago

Comber

Average nearer 15 years. Cost £4k +

As stated, unless in ultra insulated new-build, generally provide less heat so need to upgrade radiators too.

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By *hiteroseMan
3 days ago

Neverwhere

Another consideration is this. A conventional gas boiler can be installed at relatively low cost, but may have higher fuel costs.

By contrast, a heat source pump may be cheaper to operate, but will undoubtedly cost a lot more to install.

Perhaps the savings made by installing a gas boiler might help offset higher gas costs over the projected life of the boiler.

But the crucial consideration is maybe a personal one. How long do you intend being in the house?

If this is your final move then it may be a smart move to have the hassle of a completely new system now, rather than in 15 years when the gas boiler needs replacing. But, if you think you'll be moving again within the next 10 years then just bang in another gas boiler and leave it for a future owner to sort out.

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
3 days ago

Luton

"Another consideration is this. A conventional gas boiler can be installed at relatively low cost, but may have higher fuel costs.

By contrast, a heat source pump may be cheaper to operate, but will undoubtedly cost a lot more to install.

Perhaps the savings made by installing a gas boiler might help offset higher gas costs over the projected life of the boiler.

But the crucial consideration is maybe a personal one. How long do you intend being in the house?

This is likely to be a final move. The property we are buying will need to be completely re plumbed as well as a new heating system installed. We do have quite a bit of electrical work needing done. New consumer unit etc

The initial plan was a replumb new boiler and radiators. There is too much copper linked to plastic. I’m probably a bit old fashioned as in I prefer copper. Our energy supplier has suggested the heat pump idea as we will be doing substantial works. I do get the fact the heat output isn’t as rapid as gas. I am assured that it will produce similar heat output.

I don’t have a preference. However what’s making me consider the heat pump is there is a government grant of up to 7.5 k to install it. As I have to install something 7 and a half grand is a big inducement.

The property is 3 bed 1950’s build and it will be under going a full refurbished inside and out

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By *atesandmoreMan
3 days ago

crooked spire town

Forget the heat pump unless you're gonna insulate, insulate and insulate. Plus, the full grants available will probably require you to have full solar power and even more insulation as well as the insulation that is insulating the insulation.

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By *amie1402Man
3 days ago

liverpool

Heat pump will cost you anything around 15k

It’s not just the boiler - it’s all new radiators and pipe work you will need to go with it

The grants don’t cover the half of it.

And then redecorating when the fitters have finished of course

Just get yourself a new boiler

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By *tagman6930Man
3 days ago

SW London

"Heat pump will cost you anything around 15k

It’s not just the boiler - it’s all new radiators and pipe work you will need to go with it

The grants don’t cover the half of it.

And then redecorating when the fitters have finished of course

Just get yourself a new boiler "

The OP has posted that the property is being refurbished inside and out so all new radiators and decorating is probably not an issue. They will be done anyway.

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
1 day ago

Luton

The property we’re moving to. Requires a complete new heating system. The insulation is already good but is getting improved. It will also partially be getting rewired and to modern code consumer unit.

On top of that. It will be getting the radiators replaced and most of the plumbing sorted. I hate exposed pipes.

We’ve been quoted for the plumbing work including gas boiler already. So we do know what that will roughly cost. The heat pump system comes with a 90% grant up to £7500. So our energy supplier thinks outlay will be £500 plus plumbing.

I’ve asked here and in other forums I’m on for advice . Loads of folks have opinions but very few with experience.

One or two have sung the praises of the heat pump idea but I’m not wholly convinced. I’m kind of on the fence at the moment.

It would be cheaper to put in a gas combi boiler assuming all things being equal. We have to re plumb as well as the heating system Although I don’t think we could use our existing suppliers if we opt for the heat pump.

I have a month or so before I have to decide so I guess I’ll see how it goes

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By *nthebuffMan
1 day ago

Liskeard

May well an issue with the one my neighbour has had installed, but the bloody thing is fairly noisy at times, especially noticeable tonight in the colder temps

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By *aul_tim2000Man
1 day ago

Grantham

Whichever system you go for don't forget to add some localised heating in at least one room. Unless you use every room in the house all day you'll probably end up with one room that is occupied the majority of the time, have some way of heating this (woodburner, gas stove....) without paying to heat the rest of the house.

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By *xmcdTV/TS
1 day ago

Wrexham

They’re best in new build ultra efficient insulated properties with small rooms. Older properties need larger rads, one other thing to consider is where the property is. Does it back into or is it near farmland because mice love those air source heat pumps. Easy to make a nest in and warm and plenty of wires to nibble on

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
1 day ago

Luton

Property is an older one. In a coastal city. So no farms to worry about. Not overlooked with an enclosed walled rear garden.

It doesn’t have a chimney so no log burners are likely

I am leaning more towards gas at this time simply for convenience and reliability. Heat pumps are a relatively recent form of heating. So the technology may not be fully proven yet. Also the storage tank may be problematic. Depending of course where it can go.

With the replumbing needing done at this time to install heating. We may be in a position that a heat pump could be installed when any gas boiler needs replacing

The house doesn’t have solar panels and I am unlikely to fit those at this time

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By *astDevonGuyMan
1 day ago

East Devon

"Property is an older one. In a coastal city. So no farms to worry about. Not overlooked with an enclosed walled rear garden.

It doesn’t have a chimney so no log burners are likely

With the replumbing needing done at this time to install heating. We may be in a position that a heat pump could be installed when any gas boiler needs replacing

The house doesn’t have solar panels and I am unlikely to fit those at this time"

Think Gas maybe is the right decision but think from 2030 installing new gas boilers will be banned , have you considered an electric boiler , they do exist and will probably remain replaceable after 2030.

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By *orfolk_FunMan
1 day ago

Norwich

I had central A/C installed 5 years ago. I winter it can act as a heat pump deliver lovely warm air through the ceiling vents. I use it as backup heating during the winter and often during heatwaves during the summer to cool the house. I could give up central heating - I couldn't do without the A/C though.

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
1 day ago

Luton

Our first house in Luton was all electric with immersion heater and storage heaters. That is a system I wouldn’t go back to even if it was free

We have a portable A/C unit in our existing home. Gets vented like a tumble dryer. Wonderful in summer and one of the best investments I made. I have used the type that you can switch to heat mode in the past. Very popular in Spain. May well look at air con as an addition. I honestly hadn’t thought about that until now

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By *3versMan
1 day ago

glasgow

If you're doing a full refurbishment have you considered underfloor heating rather than radiators

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By *ildwestheroMan
1 day ago

Llandrindod Wells

Looked into this with my last move as house had stood empty for some time and boiler quite ancient and probably unsafe. Because gas was already in the building with the existing boiler I was told I may not get any grant with a heat pump and/or solar heating system. Seems help is only available if gas is not present and you have oil heating or an antiquated electric system. Of course it may vary from area to area.

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
1 day ago

Luton

"If you're doing a full refurbishment have you considered underfloor heating rather than radiators "

Yes and discontinued it

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By *essa_M OP TV/TS
1 day ago

Luton

"Looked into this with my last move as house had stood empty for some time and boiler quite ancient and probably unsafe. Because gas was already in the building with the existing boiler I was told I may not get any grant with a heat pump and/or solar heating system. Seems help is only available if gas is not present and you have oil heating or an antiquated electric system. Of course it may vary from area to area."

There is definitely a gas supply although the boiler is going to the happy hunting grounds.

The only reason it came up was because we have to get our suppliers to change all the meters. They suggested the option with no obligation. We’ll probably have the survey done. Even if only to make sure that any new plumbing work will be to standard and possible to use in the future. I would assume they know the grant situation after all it was them that pointed us in that direction

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By *oosterladMan
1 day ago

ipswich

If I was refurbing the interior I'd future proof it with underfloor heating pipes or larger rads on the walls and just get a new gas boiler and live with that. Then in 15 years install the heat pump when the boiler fails and heat pump technology has hopefully improved.

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By *loryhole SuckMan
1 day ago

Barrow-in-Furness

I've heard they are quite a lot more expensive to run too

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By *EE96Man
22 hours ago

Folkestone

Unless you have a very well insulated house (rare in the UK unless its purpose built) I wouldn't waste your money as the heat output, even with new piping and better radiators, isn't sufficient to heat a 'normal house' (especially up North).

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