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"Why do people take the opinion of a small minority in a group. Then give it publicity to make it sound like it has greater voice than it has...? Whether that group is trans or any other minority. " Squeaky wheel syndrome. | |||
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"When that minority voice starts to influence public policy - in this case, the policy of the Scottish Government - based on a flawed, partial interpretation of the law, then it begins to affect everyone else. " It was a total debacle by the SNP, and has lost it a lot of support up here.. | |||
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"Why do people take the opinion of a small minority in a group. Then give it publicity to make it sound like it has greater voice than it has...? Whether that group is trans or any other minority. " Seems like Stonewall have a lot to answer for. They promoted themselves to get appointed as the go-to advisory group. However they were giving advice based on what they wanted the law to say, rather than what the law actually said. This is going to take years to untangle. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women "....what's a pretend woman...? | |||
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"Too much hate and too little understanding on both sides." The extreme views on both sides usually become the loudest voices. Even though they are a minority, they drown rational debate because they make better click bait headlines. Leading to the polarisation getting bigger and bigger. It's like that in most subjects nowadays. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women ....what's a pretend woman...?"Someone with the genotype of a man and the enhanced phenotype of a 'woman'. Let's hope science triumphs over ideology.  | |||
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"Only if they've swallowed the ideology pushed by activists and equality groups who took the Equality Act 2010 and rewrote it to further their own cause. Sex always was a protected characteristic under the Act, but the zero-sum game of the activists meant it was an uncomfortable truth best not spoken about in their "trans woman are woman" push. " Can always count on Sara to give a clear-headed understanding of the issues involved. You’re views of various issues are always welcome Sara. Sometimes you seem like the only one who understands things. You’re not, and others do think like you, but you’re often the only one who can be bothered to put them down on here | |||
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"What about people who are born intersex? Born with a penis and a vagina? Does this mean I'm not allowed anywhere to pee? Sensible advice would be appreciated please. I also have a uterus and real breasts. I'm not the only one." Why not tell us from a standpoint of someone who is intersex what your own experience is... | |||
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"What about people who are born intersex? Born with a penis and a vagina? Does this mean I'm not allowed anywhere to pee? Sensible advice would be appreciated please. I also have a uterus and real breasts. I'm not the only one. Why not tell us from a standpoint of someone who is intersex what your own experience is..." All I have to say. Because I know that I will be ridiculed on here. Is that things are never as clear cut as you might think. There aren't many like me, so I do feel very caught in the middle. As I understand what it's like to be a "real woman" yes I've had periods. Amongst other things. But also having a penis I feel that I understand how many trans people get upset. The ridicule and fear can get overwhelming. I have lots of gay friends. But unfortunately some of them sit rather smuggly in judgement of trans/intersex people. I think they've forgotten how being gay was once considered abhorrent and criminal. Which is the way that trans/intersex people are sometimes targeted. We aren't criminals please try and think before you disrespect us. Most people haven't a clue about me and my kind. But I do. This recent development is potentially a big problem for us. Tell me where I am now allowed to pee? Sorry if this is uncomfortable reading for some of you. | |||
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"Why do people take the opinion of a small minority in a group. Then give it publicity to make it sound like it has greater voice than it has...? Whether that group is trans or any other minority. Seems like Stonewall have a lot to answer for. They promoted themselves to get appointed as the go-to advisory group. However they were giving advice based on what they wanted the law to say, rather than what the law actually said. This is going to take years to untangle. " It shouldn’t, because it simply upholds what Parliament decided in 2010 with the passing of the Equality Act. The ones who need to backtrack are those who set their policies based on what the likes of Stonewall told them, rather than what the law actually said. | |||
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"Why do people take the opinion of a small minority in a group. Then give it publicity to make it sound like it has greater voice than it has...? Whether that group is trans or any other minority. Seems like Stonewall have a lot to answer for. They promoted themselves to get appointed as the go-to advisory group. However they were giving advice based on what they wanted the law to say, rather than what the law actually said. This is going to take years to untangle. It shouldn’t, because it simply upholds what Parliament decided in 2010 with the passing of the Equality Act. The ones who need to backtrack are those who set their policies based on what the likes of Stonewall told them, rather than what the law actually said." An HR dept admitting they got something wrong, then issuing a speedy correction. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women ....what's a pretend woman...?"Okay. Good question. Here is my take on it. I'm not talking about crossdressers or transvestites who accept they are still men underneath their female attire. I am thinking in terms of those men who don female attire, wigs, make-up etc. insist they are now women but do nothing to try and alter their physical situation e.g. no hormone therapy, no surgery etc. A genuine transsexual usually makes some effort to become a physical woman rather than just say he/she is. | |||
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"What about people who are born intersex? Born with a penis and a vagina? Does this mean I'm not allowed anywhere to pee? Sensible advice would be appreciated please. I also have a uterus and real breasts. I'm not the only one. Why not tell us from a standpoint of someone who is intersex what your own experience is... All I have to say. Because I know that I will be ridiculed on here. Is that things are never as clear cut as you might think. There aren't many like me, so I do feel very caught in the middle. As I understand what it's like to be a "real woman" yes I've had periods. Amongst other things. But also having a penis I feel that I understand how many trans people get upset. The ridicule and fear can get overwhelming. I have lots of gay friends. But unfortunately some of them sit rather smuggly in judgement of trans/intersex people. I think they've forgotten how being gay was once considered abhorrent and criminal. Which is the way that trans/intersex people are sometimes targeted. We aren't criminals please try and think before you disrespect us. Most people haven't a clue about me and my kind. But I do. This recent development is potentially a big problem for us. Tell me where I am now allowed to pee? Sorry if this is uncomfortable reading for some of you." Pee in exactly be same places you have peed before , I guess ? | |||
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"What about people who are born intersex? Born with a penis and a vagina? Does this mean I'm not allowed anywhere to pee? Sensible advice would be appreciated please. I also have a uterus and real breasts. I'm not the only one. Why not tell us from a standpoint of someone who is intersex what your own experience is... All I have to say. Because I know that I will be ridiculed on here. Is that things are never as clear cut as you might think. There aren't many like me, so I do feel very caught in the middle. As I understand what it's like to be a "real woman" yes I've had periods. Amongst other things. But also having a penis I feel that I understand how many trans people get upset. The ridicule and fear can get overwhelming. I have lots of gay friends. But unfortunately some of them sit rather smuggly in judgement of trans/intersex people. I think they've forgotten how being gay was once considered abhorrent and criminal. Which is the way that trans/intersex people are sometimes targeted. We aren't criminals please try and think before you disrespect us. Most people haven't a clue about me and my kind. But I do. This recent development is potentially a big problem for us. Tell me where I am now allowed to pee? Sorry if this is uncomfortable reading for some of you. Pee in exactly be same places you have peed before , I guess ? " Thank you for your understanding comment. I shall! | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women ....what's a pretend woman...?
Someone with the genotype of a man and the enhanced phenotype of a 'woman'. Let's hope science triumphs over ideology. "...the question wasn't for you... | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women ....what's a pretend woman...?
Okay. Good question. Here is my take on it. I'm not talking about crossdressers or transvestites who accept they are still men underneath their female attire. I am thinking in terms of those men who don female attire, wigs, make-up etc. insist they are now women but do nothing to try and alter their physical situation e.g. no hormone therapy, no surgery etc. A genuine transsexual usually makes some effort to become a physical woman rather than just say he/she is."...but it sounds like you're having a go at a particular group of people...? | |||
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"As a trans woman, its disheartening to see some cross dressers and TVs on this thread showing little empathy or understanding for the human rights of trans women and men! " Trans campaigners created this problem. Widening the definition of trans and criticising any attempt to gate-keep has damaged the ability of genuine trans people to simply get on with their lives. The problem has arisen as female spaces became infiltrated by straight men with autogynephilia or a cross-dressing fetish. | |||
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"Whats happened ? 😕" The courts have decided that the protected characteristic in the Equality Act 2010 known as sex actually means . . . sex | |||
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"As a trans woman, its disheartening to see some cross dressers and TVs on this thread showing little empathy or understanding for the human rights of trans women and men! " Your statement speaks volumes about the misogynistic theme that is the hallmark of the dogma of trans activists. | |||
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"It won't stop me dressing. " Why should it? The ruling changes nothing for anyone, except those who have been deluded by dogma that says you can actually change your sex. It's a bit of a set back for them. | |||
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"As a trans woman, its disheartening to see some cross dressers and TVs on this thread showing little empathy or understanding for the human rights of trans women and men! There's no point in having an opinion on here. Your view should be respected, and not criticised as being misogynistic. Its like I said to you before. The ignorance is stifling. Don't waste your breath. Stay safe darling x" This unfortunately is a trait of many trans activists - they want to make their own opinions known but as soon as anyone else else disagrees then it's toys out the pram... | |||
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"Apparently Hollytwitchyknickers thinks I'm not entitled to an opinion on this as I'm a "mincing nasty little queen" before courageously blocking me. I'd like to ask: Is a gay man entitled to engage in discussion and share his opinions on a website for gay and bi men about a subject that has brought everybody under the LGBTQ umbrella into renewed scrutiny? " Apparently not | |||
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"As a trans woman, its disheartening to see some cross dressers and TVs on this thread showing little empathy or understanding for the human rights of trans women and men! There's no point in having an opinion on here. Your view should be respected, and not criticised as being misogynistic. Its like I said to you before. The ignorance is stifling. Don't waste your breath. Stay safe darling x This unfortunately is a trait of many trans activists - they want to make their own opinions known but as soon as anyone else else disagrees then it's toys out the pram..." Really? She hasn't thrown any toys out of the pram. Stop making it personal. | |||
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"All of my comments are shown above. Personal insult free. " Stop the insults. Your behaviour is unacceptable. | |||
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"Does it mean pro nouns will go in the bin too?" I hope so | |||
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"What rights of yours have been impacted or infringed by today's ruling? " You have rather a high opinion of yourself and your odd views. Does Simone know you are a trouble maker? Behave yourself. She doesn't have to answer to you. | |||
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"Ah, the identity and profile might have changed but the belligerent bullying behaviour has not, I see " Hard to imagine why any biological women would be concerned about sharing a female only space.  | |||
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"Delighted for graham linehan " Shame to think of all the great comedy we have missed out on while he was "cancelled". | |||
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"Ah, the identity and profile might have changed but the belligerent bullying behaviour has not, I see " Yes you bet darling See ya soon xx | |||
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"Ah, the identity and profile might have changed but the belligerent bullying behaviour has not, I see " Some of us have to work! We cant all go swanning off to Benidorm. I hope you didn't get too sunburnt. Still name calling I see. Naughty little girl xx | |||
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"Ah, the identity and profile might have changed but the belligerent bullying behaviour has not, I see Hard to imagine why any biological women would be concerned about sharing a female only space. "Little Red Riding Hood isn't a Russian condom Every folk tale is a lesson from history | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women "Didn’t god give you a cock to fuck pussies ? | |||
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"Ah, the identity and profile might have changed but the belligerent bullying behaviour has not, I see Hard to imagine why any biological women would be concerned about sharing a female only space.
Little Red Riding Hood isn't a Russian condom
Every folk tale is a lesson from history
""Oh, grandmother, what big hands you have!" "What a big cock and balls you have." | |||
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"Don't understand why on earth it had to go to court in first place if u were born with a cock u r male if born with a pussy female simple " Because they don’t see it as you describe it. It is like telling the colourblind people why don’t you see the colours. You don’t get that part because you are not one of them. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women
Didn’t god give you a cock to fuck pussies ? "Seems he put your prostate just in a place where a cock can hit just right too | |||
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"If you're on the same side as GB news, JK Rowling, Piers Morgan and Kemi Bad enough you should question yourself." What if you are on the same side as the High Court? Should you question yourself? Also have you actually read anything that JK Rowling has written on this topic? | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women "It's sad something so base needed clarification. | |||
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"If you're on the same side as GB news, JK Rowling, Piers Morgan and Kemi Bad enough you should question yourself." Who is on the other side? | |||
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"If you're on the same side as GB news, JK Rowling, Piers Morgan and Kemi Bad enough you should question yourself." Think you need to question yourself fella! You don't think biological women and girls deserve the right to have their own spaces and groups without getting into trouble or being treated as a criminal for not wanting biological men in there with them? 
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"If you're on the same side as GB news, JK Rowling, Piers Morgan and Kemi Bad enough you should question yourself. Think you need to question yourself fella! You don't think biological women and girls deserve the right to have their own spaces and groups without getting into trouble or being treated as a criminal for not wanting biological men in there with them?
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"J.K.Roling much be chuffed to bit's " Tempted to send flowers. Everybody knows where she lives after she got doxxed by trans activists. | |||
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"The Isla Bryson case exposed the inherent contradictions and idiocy of adopting gender ideology as policy. The first rule when you are in a hole is to stop digging. It seems the SNP government carried on digging." Unless you're imagining there's a chest of gold waiting for you if you dig deep enough. Usually there isn't any... | |||
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"The Isla Bryson case exposed the inherent contradictions and idiocy of adopting gender ideology as policy. The first rule when you are in a hole is to stop digging. It seems the SNP government carried on digging. Unless you're imagining there's a chest of gold waiting for you if you dig deep enough. Usually there isn't any..." The Greens are still digging that hole. Would be ironic if they struck oil. | |||
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"Whats happened ? 😕 The courts have decided that the protected characteristic in the Equality Act 2010 known as sex actually means . . . sex" Also know as gender. | |||
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"Whats happened ? 😕 The courts have decided that the protected characteristic in the Equality Act 2010 known as sex actually means . . . sex Also know as gender. " No, it's not. That is the point of this ruling. Sex is one of the protected characteristics. . Gender is a separate protected characteristic. They are not the same. Your sex is immutable. Your gender identity is changeable. It should have obvious to anyone who understands the Equality Act 2010, because it always contained provision to exclude people from a same-sex space, where the purpose is legitimate and reasonable. | |||
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"Wasn't it the " Judean Peoples front" who first stopped a man's right to have babies.. "The people’s front of Judea decided a man has a right to have babies, even though they haven’t got a womb. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women "In a perverse way it cements the argument that trans women belong on this site | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women
In a perverse way it cements the argument that trans women belong on this site ""This judgment resolves the difficulties we highlighted in our submission to the court and in our advice to the former Minister for Women and Equalities more than two years ago. These include the challenges faced by those seeking to maintain single-sex spaces, and the rights of same-sex attracted persons to form associations." Baroness Kishwer Falkner, Chair, Equality and Human Rights Commission Lesbian women have been beaten up for years as "transphobes" for refusing to contemplate people with a cock as a partner. Hopefully now these idiots will be put back in their box by this ruling | |||
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Hopefully more dismantling of the woke madness will follow... | |||
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"This is a step in the right direction for this country, a historical moment for biological women and their rights
Hopefully more dismantling of the woke madness will follow..." | |||
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"Thank god You are only one of 2 sexes The idiots will be pissed off! " Sending me abuse in a dm and then blocking me before I reply tells me all I need to know about you. | |||
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" Also have you actually read anything that JK Rowling has written on this topic? " I always found her thoughts on this very measured and rational. She understands the difference between sex and gender identity, and pushed back against efforts to make the two interchangeable. It always struck me as insightful how the activists piled into women who shone a light on this with a torrent of abuse, but merely shrugged their shoulders at men who did the same. | |||
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"All this would be academic, of course, had Farage won the election - one of his promises was to repeal the Equality Act 2010, the legal basis of yesterday's ruling. Now, government officials in London have been leaking the demands of the US administration in their talks about trade. One of them is the UK repeals the legislation that protects LGBT and others from hate under the guise of "free speech". It seems Vance and their chums are now doing the bidding of Farage. " You have it bad babe. X | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. " Most men know the difference between male and female. Most men can understand the need for women to have female-only spaces. Most men care about women. Many gay men can see there is overt homophobia in some of the trans activist's ideology. | |||
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"All this has done has further vilified a minority group, within our own LGBT community. This is simply going to affect those playing make believe and jumping on a band wagon, not real trans people who quietly go about their lives. Yet another imbecilic decision which is not applicable in reality. What are they gonna do? A genital inspection upon entry to a toilet?? Yet again, it focuses on men with gender dysphoria and not a single mention of females with gender dysphoria, of course. This is about a warped, disingenuous belief that all trans men are actually up to no good, seedy characters who's entire life ambition is to sit in womens toilets. Little did they know, they only needed to come to Fab to get their perverted fix. A sad, sad day when a community can sit doing the 5 knuckle shuffle to a cock in a frock but are appalled that a trans woman can exist. " Exactly. | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. " And you do right? You sound like a right pillock mate 
Also, assuming everyone's gender are you?! | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. And you do right? You sound like a right pillock mate
Also, assuming everyone's gender are you?! "No, thats my whole point. None of us know what women feel on this issue, which is what this is about. As we are not women. This doesn't help the true transgender people. | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. And you do right? You sound like a right pillock mate
Also, assuming everyone's gender are you?!
No, thats my whole point.
None of us know what women feel on this issue, which is what this is about. As we are not women.
This doesn't help the true transgender people."Many genuine transgender people were the first to call out the problems that would arise from allowing anybody to self-identify. | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. Most men know the difference between male and female. Most men can understand the need for women to have female-only spaces. Most men care about women. Many gay men can see there is overt homophobia in some of the trans activist's ideology. " So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women". | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. Most men know the difference between male and female. Most men can understand the need for women to have female-only spaces. Most men care about women. Many gay men can see there is overt homophobia in some of the trans activist's ideology. So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women"." if he’s completed transition he is no longer trans. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women ....what's a pretend woman...?
Okay. Good question. Here is my take on it. I'm not talking about crossdressers or transvestites who accept they are still men underneath their female attire. I am thinking in terms of those men who don female attire, wigs, make-up etc. insist they are now women but do nothing to try and alter their physical situation e.g. no hormone therapy, no surgery etc. A genuine transsexual usually makes some effort to become a physical woman rather than just say he/she is....but it sounds like you're having a go at a particular group of people...?"With due respect I think you are imagining things. I was always prepared to accept that transwomen, who lived as women and had undergone surgery etc, were now women. Having said that I also think that they have to accept that there are certain things they cannot do e.g. get pregnant or participate in specific women's sports etc. The only group I would 'have a go' at are those predator types who pretend to be women in order to get access to women only safe spaces for whatever perverse purpose, or 'athletes' who now identify as women in order to excel in women's sports. Yes these are a very tiny minority but unfortunately give genuinely transwomen a bad name. | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. Most men know the difference between male and female. Most men can understand the need for women to have female-only spaces. Most men care about women. Many gay men can see there is overt homophobia in some of the trans activist's ideology. So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women"." The other men in the male toilet or locker-room wouldn't feel threatened by his presence. Should a Lesbian group be compelled to accept women with penises as members? Should they be condemned as transphobes for refusing to consider them as potential partners? | |||
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" So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women"." Do men, using facilities designated for men, need protection from people of the opposite sex? | |||
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" So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women". Do men, using facilities designated for men, need protection from people of the opposite sex?" Why not? There should be men only spaces the same as women only spaces. As well as predatory annoying men you get predatory annoying women especially if they've got a few glasses of vino on board. During my years in the licenced trade I had complaints about women sneaking into men's toilets. Had to bar one women from the premises as she was a frequent offended. I've also known women to wander into the 'sacred' space of a rugby changing room. Whilst some guys were not bothered a lot objected including straight guys. | |||
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"This post, all by men, pretty much proves that no men really have the faintest idea what they are talking about on this issue. Most men know the difference between male and female. Most men can understand the need for women to have female-only spaces. Most men care about women. Many gay men can see there is overt homophobia in some of the trans activist's ideology. So does a trans man, who's completed full transition and has a cock now have to use a female toilet as he is seen as still being female? It's much more complicated than just "men who pretend to be women". if he’s completed transition he is no longer trans." How do you work that out? Does this person not still live with the same chromosome build up of xx or xy a surgery having been done does not make a trans person a legitimate male or female. | |||
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"A retro step that emboldens the bigots and trumpers. I know where I stand. " Seems you stand opposed to women's rights. | |||
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"A retro step that emboldens the bigots and trumpers. I know where I stand. " How is it a retro step? The gender-based rights of transgender people are unaffected by this ruling. | |||
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"A retro step that emboldens the bigots and trumpers. I know where I stand. Seems you stand opposed to women's rights. " That’s a complete non sequitur. People’s “rights” at a fundamental level should not have anything to do with gender. Id est Right to life, liberty, and security of person Freedom from …… and forced labour Freedom of thought, conscience, and religion Etc. Discrimination based on sex is a secondary that is the fundamental right has to be breached and that it has to be done so based on gender. Saying that the SUPREME COURT ruling is playing into the hands of the bigots and MAGA types is in no way denying women’s rights. Most of the issues regarding the treatment of women revolve around outdated religious concepts we as a society need to find better was of dealing with segregation. EG if toilets didn’t have urinals and separate cubical they could be unisex. There are at least two I know of in London, and every disabled toilet already is unless you assume that disabled people are a separate sex or sexless. People’s need to grow up and start thinking about this anachronistic bullshit | |||
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"Wasn't it the " Judean Peoples front" who first stopped a man's right to have babies..
The people’s front of Judea decided a man has a right to have babies, even though they haven’t got a womb. ".. Period | |||
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"A retro step that emboldens the bigots and trumpers. I know where I stand. Seems you stand opposed to women's rights. That’s a complete non sequitur. People’s “rights” at a fundamental level should not have anything to do with gender. Id est Right to life, liberty, and security of person Freedom from …… and forced labour Freedom of thought, conscience, and religion Etc. Discrimination based on sex is a secondary that is the fundamental right has to be breached and that it has to be done so based on gender. Saying that the SUPREME COURT ruling is playing into the hands of the bigots and MAGA types is in no way denying women’s rights. Most of the issues regarding the treatment of women revolve around outdated religious concepts we as a society need to find better was of dealing with segregation. EG if toilets didn’t have urinals and separate cubical they could be unisex. There are at least two I know of in London, and every disabled toilet already is unless you assume that disabled people are a separate sex or sexless. People’s need to grow up and start thinking about this anachronistic bullshit" Lesbians being able to form groups to meet exclusively female members. Women being able to compete in sports with exclusively female competitors. Women being afforded the privacy and dignity of female-only spaces to change clothes and shower. Those are hardly anachronistic religious based beliefs. | |||
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"Does it mean pro nouns will go in the bin too?" Yeah totally. It's going to make English really make sense. | |||
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"Does it mean pro nouns will go in the bin too? " You can call yourself what you like though don't expect others to. I'd still be happy to call a genuine transwoman Madam and refer to her as her/she. However I would not pander to these silly non-binary/gender fluid fantasists by calling they/them. Might call them 'it' though. | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women
Didn’t god give you a cock to fuck pussies ?
Seems he put your prostate just in a place where a cock can hit just right too"Hope you get a twins x | |||
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"A retro step that emboldens the bigots and trumpers. I know where I stand. Seems you stand opposed to women's rights. That’s a complete non sequitur. People’s “rights” at a fundamental level should not have anything to do with gender. Id est Right to life, liberty, and security of person Freedom from …… and forced labour Freedom of thought, conscience, and religion Etc. Discrimination based on sex is a secondary that is the fundamental right has to be breached and that it has to be done so based on gender. Saying that the SUPREME COURT ruling is playing into the hands of the bigots and MAGA types is in no way denying women’s rights. Most of the issues regarding the treatment of women revolve around outdated religious concepts we as a society need to find better was of dealing with segregation. EG if toilets didn’t have urinals and separate cubical they could be unisex. There are at least two I know of in London, and every disabled toilet already is unless you assume that disabled people are a separate sex or sexless. People’s need to grow up and start thinking about this anachronistic bullshit Lesbians being able to form groups to meet exclusively female members. Women being able to compete in sports with exclusively female competitors. Women being afforded the privacy and dignity of female-only spaces to change clothes and shower. Those are hardly anachronistic religious based beliefs. " Lesbians can form female only groups Sport could be categorised by ability rather than sex. There are some sports where women are better than men Most swimming pools have cubicals for changing rather than male female changing rooms | |||
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" Lesbians can form female only groups " Stonewall thinks they are bigots when they refuse to admit people with a cock | |||
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"This is going to upset a lot of pretend women "How? It's counting??? XX=XX XY = XY What it now does is move the debate to who polices this and where? If perverts want to go in to female spaces let's say toilets or changing rooms instead of getting a dress from next they now go and get a mop and bucket, you going to stop cleaners from entering, plus or minus the dress? | |||
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"The Isla Bryson case exposed the inherent contradictions and idiocy of adopting gender ideology as policy. The first rule when you are in a hole is to stop digging. It seems the SNP government carried on digging." One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. Not seeing you swinging the same for bad acting Muslims which there are actually a lot more of, in numbers and actual percentage terms. You loose credibility on your fight for justice when you choose to pick on those who go further than you in your beliefs of dressing up | |||
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" Lesbians being able to form groups to meet exclusively female members. Women being able to compete in sports with exclusively female competitors. Women being afforded the privacy and dignity of female-only spaces to change clothes and shower. Those are hardly anachronistic religious based beliefs. Lesbians can form female only groups Sport could be categorised by ability rather than sex. There are some sports where women are better than men Most swimming pools have cubicals for changing rather than male female changing rooms " Tell that to Jenny Watson or Sall Grover. How else should we completely restructure society to appease tiny minorities. How many £trillions will it cost to rebuild every communal changing facility and public toilet. | |||
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" Lesbians being able to form groups to meet exclusively female members. Women being able to compete in sports with exclusively female competitors. Women being afforded the privacy and dignity of female-only spaces to change clothes and shower. Those are hardly anachronistic religious based beliefs. Lesbians can form female only groups Sport could be categorised by ability rather than sex. There are some sports where women are better than men Most swimming pools have cubicals for changing rather than male female changing rooms Tell that to Jenny Watson or Sall Grover. How else should we completely restructure society to appease tiny minorities. How many £trillions will it cost to rebuild every communal changing facility and public toilet. " It is now clear XX and XY must change in the toilets of birth Looking forward to those feminine XXers sharing toilets with trans men and showing perverts employed to check genitals | |||
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" One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. " I don't understand your reference. Bryson was the latest in a long line of transgender sex criminals. Followed very closely by the peado butcher Amy George. The internet is littered with examples. Sometimes you have to take a pinch of salt, though, when you read a court case involving a "woman" convicted of r-ape. | |||
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"No nothing has changed, women have always been women and men have always been men What's changed is now we have to police who enters what space " That's always been the case under the legislation. Except bodies such as the NHS and countless others were persuaded that sex-based protections should also apply to those with gender-based protections. So in their eyes, full-time and part-time transvestites joined transexuals as bona fide women. It was bonkers then, and it's bonkers now. | |||
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"The Isla Bryson case exposed the inherent contradictions and idiocy of adopting gender ideology as policy. The first rule when you are in a hole is to stop digging. It seems the SNP government carried on digging. One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. Not seeing you swinging the same for bad acting Muslims which there are actually a lot more of, in numbers and actual percentage terms. You loose credibility on your fight for justice when you choose to pick on those who go further than you in your beliefs of dressing up " Katie Dolatowski, "Amy" George. There's two more and that is just in central Scotland. | |||
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" One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. I don't understand your reference. Bryson was the latest in a long line of transgender sex criminals. Followed very closely by the peado butcher Amy George. The internet is littered with examples. Sometimes you have to take a pinch of salt, though, when you read a court case involving a "woman" convicted of r-ape. " Internet does not equal Britain or legal cases, weak, weak, weak!!! You may like popping a dress on and feeling one thing, others may actually believe they were born in the wrong body! They believe they were always women. Science will contradict that belief. Most almost ALL will never harm anyone!! Let alone a women. Infact they are more likely to be abused. But hey none of this is convenient | |||
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"No nothing has changed, women have always been women and men have always been men What's changed is now we have to police who enters what space That's always been the case under the legislation. Except bodies such as the NHS and countless others were persuaded that sex-based protections should also apply to those with gender-based protections. So in their eyes, full-time and part-time transvestites joined transexuals as bona fide women. It was bonkers then, and it's bonkers now." Never happened, people are entitled to privacy! | |||
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" One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. I don't understand your reference. Bryson was the latest in a long line of transgender sex criminals. Followed very closely by the peado butcher Amy George. The internet is littered with examples. Sometimes you have to take a pinch of salt, though, when you read a court case involving a "woman" convicted of r-ape. Internet does not equal Britain or legal cases, weak, weak, weak!!! You may like popping a dress on and feeling one thing, others may actually believe they were born in the wrong body! They believe they were always women. Science will contradict that belief. Most almost ALL will never harm anyone!! Let alone a women. Infact they are more likely to be abused. But hey none of this is convenient " Kind of an egocentric world-view to believe that just because you didn't know about it, it didn't happen. | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Nicola Sturgeon used to trot out that line when she brow-beat critics of her crazy gender policies. That it's men who are a threat to women, not trans women. Anyone who suggested otherwise was transphobic, homophobic and probably racist, too. Then up pops the latest in a long line of trans sex criminals, and she's made to look like a complete numpty." Lol!!!!! If theirs only 300 people who identify as trans the percentage will be higher!! You a clever (they) you know this | |||
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". Never happened, people are entitled to privacy!" Then you are totally ignorant of the background to this issue, and how we got to this position in the first place. | |||
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". Never happened, people are entitled to privacy! Then you are totally ignorant of the background to this issue, and how we got to this position in the first place." You make it sound like prisons and hospitals are flooded by bad acting trans people What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity | |||
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" One case, all this hinges on one bad actor. I don't understand your reference. Bryson was the latest in a long line of transgender sex criminals. Followed very closely by the peado butcher Amy George. The internet is littered with examples. Sometimes you have to take a pinch of salt, though, when you read a court case involving a "woman" convicted of r-ape. Internet does not equal Britain or legal cases, weak, weak, weak!!! You may like popping a dress on and feeling one thing, others may actually believe they were born in the wrong body! They believe they were always women. Science will contradict that belief. Most almost ALL will never harm anyone!! Let alone a women. Infact they are more likely to be abused. But hey none of this is convenient " This again | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity " I agree with that. It should not be at the expense of the right of a women to feel safe, however. | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. " Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery. | |||
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"As a trans woman, its disheartening to see some cross dressers and TVs on this thread showing little empathy or understanding for the human rights of trans women and men! " I have to say I agree. This is a forced issue where women are arguing that a certificated trans (m2f) should not be counted as a woman on head counts for equality purposes. The court has agreed with them but on the synopsis of there reasoning it's because to do otherwise is unworkable. But logically that's nuts? As a gay man am I represented by straight men? As a straight zoastern hermit am I represented by either males or female agnostics? The rolling seems arbitrary and willfully obstructive. They do say however that they are interpreting the law as it is, not as it should be. So where there are issues the law may need review. So what are the issues? Are women at risk from m2f trans and cd men more than they are from other women? Are straight men more at risk from gay men than from other men? As a straight man am I at risk of accusations for using the same urinal as a f2m man? Is there an appreciable risk ? And if it is just the fear of the risk, Is telling trans and cross dressing population that really it's all in their head and they should get on with behaving as if the are what they look like to the majority, the best answer? It dose seem like telling gay people they are fundamentally mistaken and should conform to the normal paradigm of society. Perhaps we should all go to church on the same day too for the ease of social cohesion?!?!! Having spoken to my daughter and her pals they are almost more likely now to be propositioned by another woman as they are a guy, so it can't simply be about how safe ppl feel going for a pee? | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity I agree with that. It should not be at the expense of the right of a women to feel safe, however." I agree with that! This is why it's complexed. All this ruling has done is say a women in equality act is XX It doesn't say how we police toilets but naturally that's where this will go. People will start to film XX masculine looking women in toilets, it's a mess!! It's sad, that one bad actor has created this bad faith. | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity " So women ARE justified in applying the same blanket default suspicion and prohibitions as they would for any other man. You don't magically become safe just because you identify as a woman. | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery." Why would they? Why would a section of society avoid .... anything that's not how people are that's not how society works | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery." In some cases, the underlying cause of a person's distress is not dysphoria. They reach the wrong diagnosis and the true factors causing their distress are ignored, consciously or unconsciously. The change to their identity does nothing to alleviate the underlying cause. The activists hate the term "autogeneyphilia" but it is prevalent. It is the result of broadening the definition of a "trans woman" from someone who has undergone and surgical and chemical intervention - a transexual - to include everyone who has not, including transvestites and cross-dressers whose male sex drive remains fully functional. | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity So women ARE justified in applying the same blanket default suspicion and prohibitions as they would for any other man. You don't magically become safe just because you identify as a woman. " Who's said that??? Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! The lack of knowledge and understanding around this issue is astounding let alone empathy for what they have to go through by mostly men who couldn't give a fuck about women's issues in other areas | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery. In some cases, the underlying cause of a person's distress is not dysphoria. They reach the wrong diagnosis and the true factors causing their distress are ignored, consciously or unconsciously. The change to their identity does nothing to alleviate the underlying cause. The activists hate the term "autogeneyphilia" but it is prevalent. It is the result of broadening the definition of a "trans woman" from someone who has undergone and surgical and chemical intervention - a transexual - to include everyone who has not, including transvestites and cross-dressers whose male sex drive remains fully functional." It mostly isn't, the amount of therapy you have to through before transitioning is extensive. It explores, if your a cross dresser a fantasist or an actual person loving with body dismorphia | |||
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". Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! " Where do you get your data from? | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity So women ARE justified in applying the same blanket default suspicion and prohibitions as they would for any other man. You don't magically become safe just because you identify as a woman. Who's said that??? Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! The lack of knowledge and understanding around this issue is astounding let alone empathy for what they have to go through by mostly men who couldn't give a fuck about women's issues in other areas " To quote you: "Internet does not equal Britain or legal cases, weak, weak, weak!!!" | |||
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". Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! Where do you get your data from? " Williams institute, trans women are 4 times more likely to abused | |||
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". What I'm saying is trans people are no different to us, except they want to transition. However the same percentage will be criminals of some sort it's just humanity So women ARE justified in applying the same blanket default suspicion and prohibitions as they would for any other man. You don't magically become safe just because you identify as a woman. Who's said that??? Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! The lack of knowledge and understanding around this issue is astounding let alone empathy for what they have to go through by mostly men who couldn't give a fuck about women's issues in other areas To quote you: "Internet does not equal Britain or legal cases, weak, weak, weak!!!"" Good if it was true | |||
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" It mostly isn't, the amount of therapy you have to through before transitioning is extensive. It explores, if your a cross dresser a fantasist or an actual person loving with body dismorphia " This is what I mean - you simply do not understand how we got to this position. It started in the USA in the early 2000s - a push to demedicalise the meaning of transition. "Trans woman" moved from being solely a transexual to include people who are transvestites, be it part-time or full-time. No clinical interventions needed to identify as a woman, merely the desire to live your life as one. Then came the push to bring those "demedacilised transitioners" under the umbrella of equalities legislation. | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery. Why would they? Why would a section of society avoid .... anything that's not how people are that's not how society works " Rather obvious I would have thought. Hardly anyone is in prison without good reason. Apart from certain spur-of-the-moment crimes like a crime-of-passion, a serious motoring offence etc. most crimes are premeditated. Fine a lot think they wont get caught and no doubt quite a few don't get caught. So I stand by my statement, a transsexual with an ounce of commonsense would go out of their way to avoid doing something that could carry a custodial sentence when they don't know if they are going to be sent to a male or female prison. No doubt there are some very stupid transsexuals who think they will never get caught. | |||
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". Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! Where do you get your data from? Williams institute, trans women are 4 times more likely to abused " Are you referring to transexuals or transvestites? | |||
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" It mostly isn't, the amount of therapy you have to through before transitioning is extensive. It explores, if your a cross dresser a fantasist or an actual person loving with body dismorphia This is what I mean - you simply do not understand how we got to this position. It started in the USA in the early 2000s - a push to demedicalise the meaning of transition. "Trans woman" moved from being solely a transexual to include people who are transvestites, be it part-time or full-time. No clinical interventions needed to identify as a woman, merely the desire to live your life as one. Then came the push to bring those "demedacilised transitioners" under the umbrella of equalities legislation. " No, that's what you think, there's been no push, people have become accepting, but you need therapy before you go through it. Listen I know, 2 of my work colleagues have gone through it with their husbands now wives. It isn't easy, it's a big process. Just because you read things and pop on a dress every now then does not make you an expert . | |||
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"Does it mean pro nouns will go in the bin too? You can call yourself what you like though don't expect others to. I'd still be happy to call a genuine transwoman Madam and refer to her as her/she. However I would not pander to these silly non-binary/gender fluid fantasists by calling they/them. Might call them 'it' though." Because dehumanising people is fun? | |||
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". Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! Where do you get your data from? Williams institute, trans women are 4 times more likely to abused Are you referring to transexuals or transvestites?" What's this thread about? | |||
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". Trans women are more likely to be abused by percentage of population and abuse rate! Where do you get your data from? Williams institute, trans women are 4 times more likely to abused Are you referring to transexuals or transvestites?" Did the research control for the disproportionate number of trans women who are also sex workers. | |||
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" No, that's what you think, there's been no push, people have become accepting, but you need therapy before you go through it. Listen I know, 2 of my work colleagues have gone through it with their husbands now wives. It isn't easy, it's a big process. Just because you read things and pop on a dress every now then does not make you an expert . " To obtain a GRC, that is correct - it needs to be done under medical supervision. But the definition of "trans woman" is NOT someone with a GRC. | |||
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"About 18% of the male prison population is doing time for sex crime. About 2% of the female prisons population is doing time for sex crime. About 48% of the trans population is doing time for sex crime. Except in the case of certain 'crimes of passion or miscarriages of justice I am not very sympathetic towards prisoners. In view of their 'predicament' I would have thought trans people would have been extra careful in avoiding criminal activity. Perhaps they were robbing banks or embezzling money to pay for their trip to a Thailand surgery. Why would they? Why would a section of society avoid .... anything that's not how people are that's not how society works Rather obvious I would have thought. Hardly anyone is in prison without good reason. Apart from certain spur-of-the-moment crimes like a crime-of-passion, a serious motoring offence etc. most crimes are premeditated. Fine a lot think they wont get caught and no doubt quite a few don't get caught. So I stand by my statement, a transsexual with an ounce of commonsense would go out of their way to avoid doing something that could carry a custodial sentence when they don't know if they are going to be sent to a male or female prison. No doubt there are some very stupid transsexuals who think they will never get caught." One case of an imprisoned transexual! And "they" should avoid being imprisoned Isn't the natural order of society, you avoid being imprisoned?? Pretty sure just because you identify as ..... Doesn't make you more or less inclined to crime, it's to do with socioeconomic background and I'm not sure the poor are more likely to produce trans people | |||
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