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Chemistry, Industrial cleaners advice please

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in

Looking for advice from anyone with chemical or industrial cleaning knowledge.

I have tried recommendations below but it isn't proving 100% effective.

Advice on other solutions would be welcomed.

______________________________________

Background

I have a holiday home in Tenerife that was empty for a few months, all the water in the toilets and basin traps evaporated allowing gas from the sewer system to get into the property.

This has triggered a chemical reaction I have been told is sulfidation from the Hydrogen Sulfide (H_2S) gas in the sewer system.

The gas has reacted with every surface that is chrome plated, all the taps and even plastic finishes such as shower heads.

Apparently the gas reacts with the chrome and creates silver sulfide, resulting in a thin, hard, black patina that looks like the metal has been burnt or stained, due to a chemical change on the surface of the fixture.

_______________________________________

Advice so far

Advice has been to use a mild acid such as a paste of lemon juice and baking soda or a cloth soaked in white vinegar wrapped around the fittings.

I have also been advised to try Autosol as it contains oxalic acid as it apparently breaks down sulfide layers without scratching the finish.

______________________________________

Success & other suggestions

Quite a lot of the blackening has come offf but some stubborn areas remain.

Any other suggestions?

____________________________________

Removing stains from enamel

In the main bathroom there is a victorian enamel bath with a mixer tap that includes a shower head.

The hose for the shower head was touching the enamel.

The blackening of the chrome on the hose has stained the bath enamel.

The lemon juice/ bicarb solution or white vinegar is not removing this.

Any suggestions for removing stains from enamel without scratching it?.

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By *ella321TV/TS
5 weeks ago

Milton Keynes

I take it you not insured

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


"I take it you not insured "

I do have property insurance, but don't consider it warrants a claim, it is only cosmetic and I have managed to remove the majority of the staining.

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By *athCDTV/TS
5 weeks ago

Morpeth

Beware, hydrogen sulphide is extremely poisonous the danger being exacerbated by the fact it numbs the membrane in your nostrils, so after a couple of whifs you may think it has gone. It hasn't, its still present but you are no longer detecting it. Beware and try and get a detector/ oxygen depletion meter

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By (user no longer on site)
5 weeks ago

"Apparently the gas reacts with the chrome and creates silver sulfide,"

If the fittings are chrome, what you've got isn't silver sulphide but a chromium compound . Or are the fittings actually silver, which (unlike chromium) is very prone to sulphide staining? Try ammonia, anyway.

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By *arridMan
5 weeks ago

Brighton

Tell everyone you’ve had to replace everything and have chosen a lovely chrome’/black patina in random patterns.

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


""Apparently the gas reacts with the chrome and creates silver sulfide,"

If the fittings are chrome, what you've got isn't silver sulphide but a chromium compound . Or are the fittings actually silver, which (unlike chromium) is very prone to sulphide staining? Try ammonia, anyway."

TYPO. should have said chromium sulfide.

Ammonia was the first product I tried prior to discovering what it actually is, not very effective, moved on to the bicarb/lemon and white vinegar which have removed the majority.

Now left with stubborn spots and want ideas for stronger solution that doesn't require full hazchem suit.

Thanks anyway

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By (user no longer on site)
5 weeks ago


""Apparently the gas reacts with the chrome and creates silver sulfide,"

If the fittings are chrome, what you've got isn't silver sulphide but a chromium compound . Or are the fittings actually silver, which (unlike chromium) is very prone to sulphide staining? Try ammonia, anyway.

TYPO. should have said chromium sulfide.

Ammonia was the first product I tried prior to discovering what it actually is, not very effective, moved on to the bicarb/lemon and white vinegar which have removed the majority.

Now left with stubborn spots and want ideas for stronger solution that doesn't require full hazchem suit.

Thanks anyway

"

It may oxidise slowly over time - the oxide may be easier to remove. Household bleach is an oxidant, give that a try too. (caution, caustic, chlorine fumes).

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By *hiteroseMan
5 weeks ago

Neverwhere

If bicarb/lemon or vinegar has worked on the majority, then why use something different for the stubborn spots? Just keep going.

Don't forget that the chrome is just a thin plating. Probably just a few microns. So once you have worn through that then you are down to the base metal.

But, my taps are stained and a bit mangy and they still work perfectly. Who cares if they have a mottled appearance?

Alternatively, why not just sell the property and let someone local live in it?

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


" It may oxidise slowly over time - the oxide may be easier to remove. Household bleach is an oxidant, give that a try too. (caution, caustic, chlorine fumes).

"

I tried bleach originally as I thought it was just mould prior to discovering it was a patina and learning about the chemical reaction.

Have been allowing time and revisiting, has been over a month so far and has achieved decent results, just being a bit impatient and OCD about it as only here another week.

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


"If bicarb/lemon or vinegar has worked on the majority, then why use something different for the stubborn spots? Just keep going.

Don't forget that the chrome is just a thin plating. Probably just a few microns. So once you have worn through that then you are down to the base metal.

But, my taps are stained and a bit mangy and they still work perfectly. Who cares if they have a mottled appearance?

Alternatively, why not just sell the property and let someone local live in it?"

Avoiding wearing down the plating is why I have avoided anything abrasive or corrosive and was asking advice on alternatives.

I have resolved to being patient with the bicarb solution in the absence of alternatives.

Wouldn't be so bad if were just what you describe as a mottled appearance, beside my prefering an aesthetic appearance, they looked mould ridden and unhygienic, it being caused by fumes from the sewer creating some paranoia.

Selling up would be an over reaction to say the least, even though it wouldn't be cheap for four bathrooms I could easily replace all the fittings.

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By *orchlightMan
5 weeks ago

Chippenham

Can’t help with the immediate problem but when properties are left long term a small amount of olive oil in toilet and basin traps prevents the evaporation.

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By *andomguy321Man
5 weeks ago

reading

Have you tried old-fashioned Vim & elbow grease?

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


"Can’t help with the immediate problem but when properties are left long term a small amount of olive oil in toilet and basin traps prevents the evaporation. "

Thanks, read about that trick online when searching for cleaning solutions.

It isn't normally empty for so long but I was in hospital for surgery, then dad ill and then he died plus other commitments meant I couldn't visit for 10 months.

Have now figured out a way to install plastic covers, it will require a bit of work each time lifting toilets up and removing inspection covers but will guarantee zero ingress of fumes.

Spanish drains are renowned for stinking anyway, soil stacks aren't required to be ventilated like in the UK, that will be the next improvement.

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


"Have you tried old-fashioned Vim & elbow grease?"

Have avoided anything abrasive so far, as I know chrome plating is only a few microns.

I have some Autosol in the garage that I use on motorbike, that came up as an option on web search.

I will give that a try once all 'liquid" solutions have been ruled out.

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By *andomguy321Man
5 weeks ago

reading

Try it on a small section ... If the patina is within the chrome, rather than just upon it, then it'll not come up good as new, whatever you do to remove the damage.

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By *egginzboyMan
5 weeks ago

Rugeley

We had a similar problem and found that caustic soda did the trick

We bought a 25kg bag from an industrial chemist

Apparently they use it to clean spas swimming pools industrial dish washers etc

We mixed it quite weak at first 50 gms per gallon then kept adding the crystals till we had quite an agressive mix

Be careful as it will strip anodising from aluminium and it does react with bare unplated ally

Caustic soda is also used to clean drains

Always rinse with plenty of clean water anything that youve used it on

Try a small area first

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By *nimaAnimus OP   Man
5 weeks ago

I am NOT in


"We had a similar problem and found that caustic soda did the trick

We bought a 25kg bag from an industrial chemist

Apparently they use it to clean spas swimming pools industrial dish washers etc

We mixed it quite weak at first 50 gms per gallon then kept adding the crystals till we had quite an agressive mix

Be careful as it will strip anodising from aluminium and it does react with bare unplated ally

Caustic soda is also used to clean drains

Always rinse with plenty of clean water anything that youve used it on

Try a small area first"

I read that caustic soda is an alkaline and that I need a mild acid to remove an oxide, but will give it a try, thanks

There is a widely used product in Spain known as Agua Fuerte, which is 25% hydrochloric acid, also going to try that, but just a small amount spotted on a rag and watered down as I read that it attacks other metals such as stainless steel.

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By (user no longer on site)
5 weeks ago

Caustic soda will react with some metal oxides /sulphides - it forms the sodium salt of the - comparatively acidic - metal oxide. (It will also react with you) I'd say Autosol, which contains only a very fine abrasive and is designed specifically for chrome plating, would be a better option.

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